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The ONLY reason to have PVP in a MMO...


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10 replies to this topic

#1 Nanulak

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Posted 07 June 2012 - 08:12 PM

I love faction based PVP where the winners gain something for their realm (like in DAOC). This creates a reason to PVP and actually builds a community who then cooperates with each other to gain / defend the realm rewards. Guilds talk to each other and help each other to fend off the heathens of the other realms.

For the most part, just having PVP in the game so you can kill people for fun and are rewarded for it by any means is just wrong and has no reason. What does this teach our children (age non-withstanding)?

Now I understand that teaching our youth that X clan offended Y clan so we will go to war like the Hatfields and McCoys is not a stellar example either but I can see there is a actual reason for it.

Instead of going on and on as I could well do on this topic i will leave you with this...

PVP without a reason is just dumb.
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#2 Lobo

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Posted 08 June 2012 - 05:37 AM

I think that the reason to pvp, like everything else, is just made up by those that take part on it.

You dont NEED the buff that you get from WvW to survive on the pve part of the game. If you tell yourself that this is THE ONLY REASON to go pvp, its just not true...

The reason we go to PvP is the same one we go to pve or play the game at all...
Its to have fun. To get a challenge. To try to overcome an oponent that can think and react to you, that can adapt to you as you adapt to them. Its to play against another thinking person. Thats the only true reason to pvp. Not fluffy buffs that are not trully needed... but hey, having a fluffy buff on top of a great victory is great... like a cherry on the top of the cake.

Now, if you think going on a videogame and killing other players is a bad way to "teach our kids", I have bad news for you. If you teach anything to your kids on a game like any MMO out there you are a bad parent. Its like taking your kids to karate class and saying that he should learn to kick ass so he can kick ass of everyone else.
You should teach you kids to see the game as it is: A GAME. Where its nice to have a competion, to try your best to be better than your oponents. But to always keep respect, never fall for the herassment of others and keep things clean and fair even if you could use exploits or cheats...

Games dont teach children do be violent, parents (and other people) do.
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#3 Lobo

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Posted 08 June 2012 - 08:14 AM

I just saw a really good exemple of what I'm trying to point out here.

Posted Image

This is the WvW ranking of NA servers on the last BWE.
The first on the list, with 6 wins and 0 defeats is the (unnoficial) Oceanic server.
They won becouse of time-zone, when they went into WvW there was no one to defend, when other servers went there would be some people (from NA and other places that play on the server) to defend it...

If you think that the reason to pvp is the reward (buff, coin, or whatever) you would think that they are happy, they won, they got the buff and the first place among servers...

But they are not.
They are planning to split their own communiti among diferent servers, so that they have a challenge, playing against each other. So that they have someone to play against on their own prime-time...

They want the challenge, the fight, the struggle... Not the prize or the first place... :drinks:
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#4 Liquid Wolf

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Posted 08 June 2012 - 10:23 AM

Games (Video or Otherwise) are mockeries of the real world.

Like a play, movie, or book they might provide some insight to specific situations or people, but they don't directly translate to the real-world everyday. I believe these interactive media can provide useful skills to people who work together, solve problems, and push through to accomplish objectives... but they are still just games and the skills you acquire are for that game.

These games are meant to exercise, and hone a person's current knowledge or ability... and while some might be considered good teaching tools, it is more likely a game is simply a form of entertainment or challenges.

Take the game RISK and compare it to Red Alert 3 - In both games you have a chance to hone your military strategy skills versus multiple opponents, but to try and take anything in either game as a life lesson or golden rule would likely be foolish. Set people on fire? Electrocute your enemies? Nuclear missiles? War over many countries, one right after another? Sure you could learn something, but it's a specific situation where you are expected to behave in a certain way. Most skills and knowledge you gain from this are only useful in these worlds.

If we expand this to MMOs - You'll continue to see that each MMO is setup with the expectation that you will behave in a certain way. PvP is merely one of those rulesets where you are challenged by real people rather than the situation or game. These still provide skills and knowledge that are only useful in those worlds.

Personally, I don't believe PvP teaches anything school, sports, or the workplace doesn't. There is a system, a set of rules, and everyone competes (or works together) to excel. Players usually fight for top spots, and even if not everyone can win, everyone tends to still get something. This isn't like the real world at all...

The real world is very harsh and unforgiving... Children fighting for high scores, spots on teams, and eventually scholarships and social status. Your mistakes and experiences follow you forever. Your death might be a learning experience for others, but never for you. In a way, PvP in a MMOG is actually more generous than real life.

At least in games you can try, try, try again.

Edited by Liquid Wolf, 08 June 2012 - 12:32 PM.

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#5 Nanulak

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Posted 11 June 2012 - 04:28 PM

I have to say that I am astounded by the lack of "kiddie" responses to a post like this.

This tells me something about the maturity level of the type of person who is interested in a game like this. And this pleases me.

This post was originally meant to provoke discussion and test the waters of the current membership as well as to highlight the failings of PvP for the sake of PvP. It seems this game will predominantly attract a more mature crowd and be more likely to have a sociable community. Something I have missed since my days in DAOC. Not that we had the best community in the gaming world in DAOC but both people and guilds all cooperated and accomplished things that individuals as well as guilds could not accomplish alone. This game has the potential to bring back the days of old with a vibrant active community.

And by the way..... faction based PvP rules, all else drools :P
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#6 Lobo

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Posted 11 June 2012 - 04:38 PM

I dont think the maturity level on this topic is a merit of GW2, but from CotP itself...

Not that I think the game community ia bad, its just that,

The people on this guild are just great... :blush:
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#7 jaif

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Posted 11 June 2012 - 07:54 PM

PvP is about competition and adrenaline, not "killing". I know we all use the slang, but it's dangerous at time. Nobody's getting hurt, nothing is going wrong. Yes, I've been ganked, stomped, and otherwise crushed by superior forces (and people who were just plain better than me). No big deal.

That said, I too like faction-based PvP better, for a few counts:

1) Forced teams make it easier to get in a group. Heck, even if you solo you can still do so with a bunch of people on your side.

2) The context provides an RPG edge to the game. I'm not big into role-playing online, but being part of a faction is just the right dose of it for me.

3) Big, free-form battles ("zergs") are simply more fun for me. I love it when you can't easily tell who's outnumbered, and when a flank attack by a couple groups can turn the tide.


-Jeff
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#8 Morg

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 12:32 PM

I love the thinking that goes into well thought out pvp battles, out manuevering your opponents, or being out-manuevered. It sharpens your brain, gets your heart rate up, and when you win, it feels great! But, for me, even the losses were fun, and I still talk more about the fun losses than the wins.

LIke that time in Darkfall when we were helping defend a city on the island and grim and i died, ended up at a stone naked with our swords and turned around and !!!! 100's of the enemy on horseback running towards us!

That is fun! Having stories to tell afterward that bring a smile or laugh, that to me, is why I like PvP.

Oh and Winning of course! hehe
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#9 Grim

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 12:45 PM

I told you never to mention the fact that we saw each other nakid, just before we re slaughtered again!

But that was a blast.

The times we had in Shadowbane were also a blast, with our well trained guildmates. We maed a big difference in our alliance. :D

Cheers
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#10 Leah

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 12:59 PM

I think there are as many reasons to PvP as there are people who have an opinion. We are, if nothing else, a vocal group--thank Dwayna! :D

--Leah
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#11 Morg

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 01:48 PM

Necro blast group FTW lol that was fun.
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